Nurturing Our Planet and Our Food System : How and Why of Eating Clean

Vai Kumar: [00:00:00] Hey folks, welcome to another episode on podcast Fresh Leaf Forever. Today, we have here the wonderful Satyajit Hange. He's the co founder of Two Brothers Organic Farms, a biodiverse organic ecosystem certified by EcoCert, based out of Maharashtra, India. Satyajit, with a background in economics and an MBA, coupled with rich experience in the banking sector, turned to find peace and started two brothers, organic farms, along with his brother, Ajinkya Hange, from a transition from a corporate life to farming, which he calls, they are professional problem solvers. 

Vai Kumar: So it's with great joy that I'm going to sit down here to have this conversation with Satyajit. Welcome here to Podcast Fresh Leaf Forever. How are you doing?  

Satyajit Hange: Hi Vai, and hi everybody in the community. for inviting me and [00:01:00] it's a pleasure speaking to you.  

Vai Kumar: I think it's just going to be a wonderful conversation because with sustainability at the focus for me in Season 3 of this wonderful show that has reached all global continents and listeners in like several parts of the world, including rural towns like yours in India and in other parts of the world. 

Vai Kumar: It just gives me So much joy to start this conversation with you here. So why don't you take us through the science of, say, growing all these sustainable products? Because people seldom like me sitting here at home. I don't realize the interconnection of all these species and what kind of a positive impact even, sustainable farming has. 

Vai Kumar: on the community in terms of our health, in terms of all the good microbes and things like  

Satyajit Hange: that. Yeah awesome. , I'm a farmer's son and both me and Ajinkya and we grew on a farm, but we were put in [00:02:00] a boarding school where we were doing a job and, the fascination for farming got us back. 

Satyajit Hange: When we came back, we realized that Farming is not only the profession of growing food, but it's connected to everything from, like you said, the smallest microbes to even global warming. We realize that for farming, the right way, all you have to do is increase the number of microbiology in the soil. 

Satyajit Hange: The soil functions in a very, complex but simple form. The soil has all the required nutrients for the tree or for the plants to grow for the next couple of million years. The deeper you go, the density of these nutrients keep on increasing. But the form of these nutrients is they are in an unavailable form. 

Satyajit Hange: So it's like I'm giving you grains to eat. You can't eat the wheat grain directly. You have to grind it, make it up, make a flour, bake a bread and then consume that. Similarly, this unavailable form of nutrient has to be converted to an available form. How do you do it? This [00:03:00] is what modern science did not teach us. 

Satyajit Hange: And especially as farmers, where They recommend using, chemical based, nutrients to administer via the soil or via the leaf through a spray and growing plants and food in that fashion. But nature functions very simply. The more the number of microorganisms in the soil, and by microorganisms I mean your bacteria, fungi, nematode, protozoa, and so many other available forms of nutrients, two available forms. and provided to the to the plant. And this is a very symbiotic ecosystem. The plant through its white root releases an adjugate, which is a transparent substance. Suppose it needs boron, a micronutrient. It'll release an adjugate that attracts boron bacteria, solubilizing bacteria. And this bacteria is then eaten by the fungi and boron is released and the tree takes it. 

Satyajit Hange: And this happens in three seconds. And that's how plants grow in the jungle without any human interference. [00:04:00] And that's how agriculture was being done in a country like India for a couple of thousand years. And all this agriculture that was done was sustainable. The farms never lost fertility. 

Satyajit Hange: The soil never lost the capacity to retain moisture and water. And trees grew giving you fruits that were rich in all the nutrients. But somewhere down the line to boost productivity, we implemented what is today called as contemporary agriculture and in the course administered a lot of chemical fertilizers and kill those microorganisms, burn the carbon in soil. 

Satyajit Hange: And today we have reached a stage where soil is not fertile, it doesn't have water holding capacity, there is no biodiversity, and the food that grows is not nutrient rich. To give you an example, an apple, , in the early 1940s and 50s in the U. S. Contained X number of nutrients, which were, enough to give you [00:05:00] vitality and to give you all the essential nutrients. 

Satyajit Hange: And that's why they said an apple a day keeps the doctor away. But today to get the same number of nutrients, you have to eat 32 apples. That's the sad state of affairs right now.  

Vai Kumar: So that's a great introduction right there. What then is the role of farmers in preserving this ecosystem? 

Vai Kumar: Or rather, it seems like an alarming sign, right? That if we are transitioning out of all the good practices, and everybody is just focusing on bulk and increasing the productivity. So what is the role of farmers? It's almost seems like an SOS right now.  

Satyajit Hange: Yeah, absolutely. Farming for me is not only a profession. 

Satyajit Hange: In India, with the culture that we have of farming, we're always guardians of the soil. The soil is considered to be mother, in my local language, it's called Kari Ai, Black Mother. And we call our mother Ai. I, I always keep saying this, [00:06:00] that farmers need to look at. The soil and farming as guardians of this biodiversity of the soil. 

Satyajit Hange: Cultures are built when soil is fertile and cultures have collapsed when soil has become unfertile. It's basically common sense. If it's fertile soil, it grows good food. People can thrive and, you can live a healthy life if there is good food. If that isn't there the essentially the entire civilization So as farmers, I feel we have to look at ourselves as guardians, protect the soil and pass it on to the next generation who wants to do farming. 

Satyajit Hange: We have got this opportunity to do so much of good to soil microbiology, to biodiversity. Above the soil, there are birds, there are various species that live in the farm. When it's a biodiverse farm, there are heirloom varieties of crops you grow. It's your duty to protect and take forward those heirloom native varieties. 

Satyajit Hange: And in the long term, when you grow perennials and a food [00:07:00] forest, you are sequestering more carbon dioxide from the atmosphere in the soil. Today, carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is a big problem because it's leading to global warming. And there are so many other adverse effects of global warming. But when you practice this kind of farming and you're thinking that. 

Satyajit Hange: I would say not so beneficial carbon dioxide that is there in the atmosphere and sequestering it in the ground. And it becomes turns to carbohydrates and stuff when it is sequestered on the ground and becomes of use to the plant. I think a farmer is the best scientist alive today. 

Satyajit Hange: A farmer is somebody who will help preserve and protect the mother earth the way it is instead of finding a land up in Mars or some other planet.  

Vai Kumar: Very well said. And you guys have easily sequestered 70, 000 tons or more of carbon dioxide in the process of all this work that you're doing at Two Brothers Organic Farms. 

Vai Kumar: And what then is the role of, say, [00:08:00] part of it, as much as farmers want to stay ethical, want to stay true to Mother Nature, want to stay true to their ideology and everything, there is also the role of society, right? In terms of even consumer support is pivotal to this sustainable ecosystem. What then, Satyajit, is the role of consumers? 

Vai Kumar: Because to me, I have used your products. I love your products. I know the benefit out of it. One of your Instagram posts was like very interesting coming out of two brothers the Instagram handle. One day, it beautifully highlighted how. Jaggery, the natural sweetener, if you put it out on the counter, it attracts ants and it attracts other species, right? 

Vai Kumar: Right there, we talked about microbes. That's why I had you even start with the interconnection of species and the role of good bacteria and microbes. Right there, it's [00:09:00] pointers that a product that spoils or a product that attracts microbes is the real one. and it's not like chemical laden, right? 

Vai Kumar: So only when it's laden with preservatives that you just put it out for months and months and nothing happens. It seems like it's staying fresh. So for consumers like me to understand the importance of good products out there that not only taste delicious, but also is like full of this good ecosystem, microbes and everything. 

Vai Kumar: How can we appreciate that and help farmers like you and weigh the pros and cons? 

Satyajit Hange: I feel it's a very close knit ecosystem which needs to be supported by consumers. I think consumers need to get aware of choice impacts, farmers, biodiversity. Water and so many other things that I just spoke about. 

Satyajit Hange: Because when you choose food with [00:10:00] chemicals, you are voting for those practices. And a farmer will keep growing it in that way. I agree, organic food is costly. It's costly today because very few farmers are growing it. The economics of scale and all other stuff don't work in the favor of somebody who's growing food organically. 

Satyajit Hange: It's very difficult. And I think when you vote, when you choose to have food that is not grown with chemicals, you're voting for a farmer that's growing it the right way. I agree you'll have to pay a premium, but that premium will go a long way in supporting the right practices and supporting Mother Earth that will keep it in a livable condition for the future generation. 

Satyajit Hange: And that premium is not a lot. Either way, we are paying a huge price because of the adverse effects of global warming and because of eating food that is laden with so much chemicals that give you various other health problems. So as a consumer, become aware choose [00:11:00] food that is grown the right way. And automatically farmers will know there's a demand for food that's grown the right way and will shift their practices. to sustainable organic practices. Otherwise, there are very few farmers like me, Ajinkya, and the others who we work with, and two brothers, who proactively, without considering the economic benefit of the commercials, have opted to do organic farming. And I don't expect this from 99 percent of farmers, because They live on a very tight budget and it's difficult for them to take a risk with their produce and take a hit in productivity or expect a higher value for their goods. That's the case. I think you should choose what you're eating.. 

Vai Kumar: Yeah. It's an education issue with the consumers also, right? Yeah. Either you are paying for good food, good practices, and that way, you just build that ecosystem and you encourage several farmers to put out that plethora of supply of good products, or you are just [00:12:00] eating bad products and you're ruining your health and paying at the pharmacy. 

Vai Kumar: So it's just a trade off and it's something that's more of an education issue with the consumer, like you pointed out. And right there, I also could completely tell your passion when you said, Okay, you're just focusing so much on this and you transition from your corporate journey. to becoming this conservationist and farming and, you all call yourself farmers are professional problem solvers. 

Vai Kumar: So why don't you take us through your journey, Satyajit? I know you had your own little share of health issues, I believe some back issues and things like that. So what has been the transformation for you, say from that mundane corporate life to finding peace, like you call it? 

Satyajit Hange: So it's been a different life that I'm living compared to what I was living in the corporate world earlier. 

Satyajit Hange: Like I said, I'm a farmer's son. I was born in this small village which I'm sitting in. It's a hundred year old house. It's called a [00:13:00] Wada and I love this. It's a simple place. And we were put in a boarding school in Pune, the nearest town where we studied from our kindergarten to our post graduation. I did my MBA and then started working with banks like Citibank. 

Satyajit Hange: Ajinkya followed same route and worked with a couple of banks. But somewhere there was this vacuum of sorts, somewhere there was this lull of sorts where we were not enjoying what we were doing, though if you were getting these fancy designations and a good pay package and stuff, and to get to roam the world, we were not loving what we were doing. 

Satyajit Hange: When we thought, about what we love to do the answer was farming. Farming in India, or even worldwide, is not looked as a profession where you evolved to do where you earn money, where you have social respect, all that is missing in farming today. But since we wanted to pursue our calling, we went to the farm and started farming for the love of farming. 

Satyajit Hange: I think two, three years into farming, we realized that we'll have to sell the produce at the right price. That's when the brand [00:14:00] was born so that we can continue with the practices that we are doing. And then, the story slowly unfolded to where we have a couple of we have many customers in a couple of countries now and help support over 4, 000 farmers at the backend and have turned over 5, 000 acres of farms into sustainable farming. 

Satyajit Hange: That's it. When you said, issues when I was working, yes, I remember being in a boarding school and we were good at sport. We were always healthy and, played a lot of sports. When I took up a job in a bank, it was mostly sitting and working. 

Satyajit Hange: And that's when at age, I think 27, 28, I just couldn't walk a couple of meters. I had this very a striking pain in my leg. And I was wondering what that pain is. And when I got myself diagnosed, I realized that that pain is basically I had a herniated, a disc herniation, which is commonly called as a slip disc. 

Satyajit Hange: When I asked my doctor, he said, this is common with people who sit for long hours and sitting is a new cancer. And I'm like, I [00:15:00] was healthy and playing a sport all my life. And what does this happen to me? And during that same time, this dilemma of doing what I want to do and doing what I love doing was running in my mind. 

Satyajit Hange: And, all this thing coupled together and we left our jobs and came back to the farmland and started working some chiropractic, but mainly keeping myself moving and, building that muscle and sweating it out on the farms with some exercise. I didn't have to undergo any surgery. And today. 

Satyajit Hange: I do half marathons every fortnight and run eight kilometers every alternate day while working in the farm. On an average, you walk around 20, 20, 2000 steps a day and there is no pain, when you mentioned that, it's like another life I was living then and another life that I'm living now. 

Vai Kumar: I can totally relate to that. It's all getting out in the open and being able to breathe that fresh air seems to make so much of a difference rather than being stuck to desks and doing the same old stuff, right? Okay, [00:16:00] focusing on this education aspect of, making consumers realize even What goes into the whole science of being able to provide sustainable products and you touched upon it a little bit. 

Vai Kumar: What then is this regenerative agriculture? Because people hear all kinds of terms and they just, don't seem to be able to be very sure of what is what, right? Even certain organic certifications and things like that just doesn't seem to cut it for certain customers. So why don't you take us through all of that and the challenges you as a farmer face in terms of even being able to provide such clean products, Satyajit? 

Satyajit Hange: Everybody is now familiar with the word organic farming. Organic farming means not using any chemical pesticides. to grow food and not ruining soil fertility, but organic farming today allows you to monocrop, to grow only [00:17:00] one single crop. Organic farming today allows you to use external organic inputs, which are manufactured in a factory or something, a biological or something. 

Satyajit Hange: All these are allowed. Regenerative is, has come to correct all this. Regenerative means, today. If I'm farming and growing say 10 sacks of wheat and I'm removing that kind of matter from the ground, I am replenishing the ground with a lot more, that allows the ground to, the soil to grow 12 sacks next year and not only extracting. 

Satyajit Hange: So regenerative practices means you are regenerating the fertility of the soil. even better than what you had when you started farming. And these include practices of natural farming like mulching the ground with farm waste not monocropping but polycropping, growing to an extent non hybrid, non GMO food and using dung as manure, using other natural [00:18:00] stuff as manure. 

Satyajit Hange: So all these are practices of regenerative agriculture.  

Vai Kumar: Okay. Some of the challenges you as a farmer face in being able to provide such clean products, right? Is it just the cost alone or is it anything else that's like a roadblock to you guys being able to consistently just do this or for many farmers to do this day in and day out? 

Satyajit Hange: The first block is the social conditioning. 99 percent of farmers do not do organic farming. So in my village and I'm, when I say my, I am speaking on behalf of the farmers that we work with. In my village, when I want to change my practice and go to organic, I will be ridiculed by everybody in the village because I am doing something that's against the the tide or the wave. 

Satyajit Hange: And I would be made a fool out of for experimenting. So that's number one challenge. Number two is the ecosystem that is there in the agricultural landscape, the agricultural [00:19:00] colleges, the government, agricultural departments, the research and development and agricultural sciences is 99 percent oriented towards. 

Satyajit Hange: chemical based farming, conventional based farming. It's not there for organic farming. I learned organic farming by speaking to older people who learned it from their older generations. So it's come through that stream, but there is no scientific research and development in a large scale that educates people. 

Satyajit Hange: Even agricultural graduates on how to do organic farming. So that is a challenge getting seeds native while we do organic farming. We do not use any hybrid or GMO seeds. We use native heirloom variety of seeds. Getting hand on those seeds is very difficult. There are no seed banks that government keeps. 

Satyajit Hange: Farmers like you and me and people who love this kind of farming have developed a seed bank. So we don't have the money to keep it well, to research, to grow their production capabilities and. to make them better. Third [00:20:00] is manure. We rely on cow dung manure to a large extent to do this kind of farming. 

Satyajit Hange: Then when you're actually doing farming, it is managing your weeds. Initial, weeds keep growing. It's difficult to manage weeds. There's a lot of manual labor involved in removing weeds since you cannot spray any Roundup or Glyphosate, which is a carcinogenic. Weedicide used widely amongst farmers across the world. 

Satyajit Hange: So I have to remove weeds manually. And lastly, I would say the marketplace, it's very difficult for me to find a marketplace that does justice to all the efforts that we have put to grow food in such a clean way and to sell the produce at the right price for the consumer. That's the last challenge. 

Vai Kumar: Okay. So I see several challenges there in being able to even maintain this or keep this going, like sustenance of the system. So we'll come to that in a bit. But what about the impact of. Pollution. We [00:21:00] all know how our air quality is, how our water quality is, how our marine life is, how soil is. 

Vai Kumar: You talked about the soil a little bit earlier, but what about the other things that have to all coexist in this, like universe for us to even be able to see a continuity or for many farmers to be able to even do something like this. 

Satyajit Hange: Absolutely. I think we feel we are disconnected from everything around us. 

Satyajit Hange: And as humans, our job is to I would say take our things and unsurvive without worrying. We do not worry about the implications of our action on water, on oceans, on soil, on the climate  

Satyajit Hange: and this requires wisdom. And, I feel that we all need to think very holistically to realize that we are living in a continuity and not in isolation. Every action of ours has [00:22:00] some or the other repercussion on nature, on living organisms around us. And we should be mindful of that fact and live in with that mindfulness.  

Vai Kumar: Okay. What about Mother Nature in being able to, nurture this entire system and the role of human capital we all need abundance of rain, abundance of sun, abundance of soil, everything has to be in harmony, right? Again, how we as humans How are we impacting that when it comes to,, all the habitual stuff that we do, Satyajit and what about even the availability of all this, human capital when it comes to just contributing to this, sustenance of this ecosystem? 

Satyajit Hange: Yeah, absolutely. We feel that it'll take a long time for the repercussions to show up, but it was not too far when the industrial revolution happened and it's not too far since the carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere have gone up. And our generation, it [00:23:00] was just like a 50, 60 years back since this all this started chemical farming in India started a 50 year back, a 55 year back, and it's already ruined 30 percent of India's soil. 

Satyajit Hange: It's already producing food. 90 percent of the food in India is chemically laden, and that's leading to many people having chronic diseases and ill health. So it happens very fast. It's not something that our next generation will face. The repercussions of global warming are something we are facing today itself. 

Satyajit Hange: There is prolonged periods of drought. There is. Prolonged periods of heavy rainfall, there's temperature dips, there is very high temperature and all these I would say anomalies used to happen once in a 20 year period. Now it's happening every third year and soon it will start happening every second year and every year. 

Satyajit Hange: And how are we even able to cope up with all of that with rising sea levels with [00:24:00] erratic rainfalls, with prolonged droughts? If you check the air quality, I was in the capital of my country in Delhi last month and the air is unbreathable, it's difficult to even breathe, simply breathe. 

Satyajit Hange: It's difficult that's the quality of air because modern techniques of farming have made farmers burn all farm waste, all that, rises up and settles down in a city like Delhi, which already has many polluting vehicles and industries, and the air is simply unbreathable, and it's causing, I think, more than 50 60 percent of the people to have lung diseases and simply they cannot just breathe in fresh air. 

Satyajit Hange: It's weird to think something. If I had told you a 50 year back that you would've to purchase water to drink, you would've laughed on me. You know that water is such a it's a, it's available everywhere. I can open the tap and drink water, but today in the villages of India also, everybody [00:25:00] drinks bottled water or everybody drinks that arrow. 

Satyajit Hange: Water, filtered water. There's a can which comes and is delivered to their houses. And I'm not saying that they shouldn't right to good health is everybody's fundamental right. But I'm saying, why is this angle of purchasing good water coming when water is a fundamental thing? And today, if I tell you that 10 years down the line, you will roam around the cities with an oxygen cylinder. 

Satyajit Hange: You laugh at me. But I am sure this will happen. This will be big business for somebody, but you will find many people in the cities walking with oxygen cylinders because of what we have done to the environment. And and yet, if you don't understand yet, if you don't wake up, then I think we deserve this catastrophe that's taking place across the world.  

Vai Kumar: Yeah, it's very pathetic, right? All of us just we seem to encourage more plastic than we should. Everywhere we are just surrounded by plastic. And very recently, it's been a lot of eye opening conversations [00:26:00] for me. And that has just led me as a consumer even to think more and more. 

Vai Kumar: And I've started just now, pretty much I've eliminated all the mixed fibers in my closet, I'm trying to just wear direct cotton, direct wool, like straight up fibers and eliminating even all the mix of, yeah, I'm just trying to do and I'm trying to sit here with experts like you in creating awareness in this forum. 

Vai Kumar: I sincerely hope that people just listen to it and benefit from it because the whole idea of this program is all about offering actionable insights to listeners.  

Vai Kumar: And in terms of, yes, these are the natural challenges that we have all magnified by our actions. But human capital. Do you see challenges in being able to preserve and being able to offer, say, A to Z of whatever you are doing? Because, farming is still Not seen as an avenue.[00:27:00]  

Vai Kumar: We talked about not honoring nature's rhythm in several ways. And we have just got against the tide. We have seen both nature's boon and nature's wrath, what about even, human capital and being able to just continue to preserve and provide. Your thoughts on that, basically. 

Satyajit Hange: If you ask me how many percent of people are noticing this and investing time and effort to pursue a business or a livelihood that protects the environment, I would say that human capital, I would call them conscious human capital is yet very small. 

Satyajit Hange: It's insignificant. The outside world the other new age industries and tech are so attractive , and, the system is such that, Nobody is incentivized to actually come and work towards making the earth better. Everybody is incentivized to just dumping on the [00:28:00] earth and manufacturing more and consuming more. 

Satyajit Hange: And hence, I think the system needs to be changed. And there are very few people who will consciously step out and try to build an alternative world and a sustainable world. And those people should be safe. And we need more of them. Presently, there are very few of them who are doing something in this fashion of sorts. 

Vai Kumar: Okay. And what do you think makes your product line unique amidst all the challenges that we have talked about? So let's just focus on your products and all the wonderful things you do, Satyajit. along with your team. 

Satyajit Hange: So I think the most unique thing about our product is the love with which we make it, but I'm just kidding. Apart from that, it's unique because it respects the soil. It respects all the microbiology in the soil. It respects the farmer who's growing it. It respects its health. It respects the climate. It respects water [00:29:00] usage. It respects heirloom native variety, which has come to us with a genetic. 

Satyajit Hange: knowledge of a couple of thousand years. And ultimately it respects tradition and culture because all the products that we make, have no additive, preservative, binder, filler, essence, perfume, color, absolutely nothing. When you read the back of pack of our labels, it is a hundred percent pure food. 

Satyajit Hange: So it respects you as a consumer and your health. And the love with which we make it, that's, I would say a difference in today's times. It should be a norm, but today it appears like a value addition, which I'm sad, everybody should be making food in this fashion and food should just be food and nothing apart from it. 

Vai Kumar: And your expansion to global markets now. So what was it that you saw was glaringly deficient here that made you realize that, this is time for us in spite of [00:30:00] all the challenges in being able to even sustain locally and provide all the clean products, you have simply decided to go big. 

Vai Kumar: And what was it that kind of caught your eye, Satyajit? I know you were here on a very long trip to the U. S.  

Satyajit Hange: Yeah, What intrigued me is that over the last five years, we have been getting a lot, many orders from the US and we never did any marketing out there, but I know it's costly to ship from India to the US, but consumers are paying for it. 

Satyajit Hange: And word of mouth was spreading in the US. So we took this 40 day tour in September and October. We went to the East coast, the West coast, the middle of US, visited around 10 cities. and met over 1100 people in person. Every evening we used to have a talk where we spoke on sustainable farming, clean food making, and we had a dinner spread when we made our products, and it was a 3 hour interaction [00:31:00] with consumers. 

Satyajit Hange: Along with that, we also visited many of the Whole Foods, the Costcos, the Walmarts, the Erewhon's, the Trader Joe's. Saw the entire market space and that's when we realized that why the state of health in the US is so bad. Because the food that you get is not real food. There is so much of other stuff and science has gone the wrong way and added all these extra stuff and made food, which is not food and actually food should be like medicine. But when we make food in India, the way the products that we're making like ghee, jaggery, wood pressed oils and everything, it's a traditional thousand year old technique, of making food. And we find there's a lot of value in taking this tradition and culture of making to the U. S. and serving them with this good food, that's like medicine for their health. 

Vai Kumar: Okay, and even here in the U. S., did you see that customers are still completely blank and they don't realize [00:32:00] what they are eating? 

Satyajit Hange: Yeah, that was that is glaringly clear. Majority of them are not aware of the food they're consuming and they have, they are illiterate to reading labels and to studying or researching about the food they're consuming day to  

Vai Kumar: day. So from that standpoint, how is this dietary and lifestyle practices going to impact our ability to have. a sustainable lifestyle, Satyajit. With your personal experience with you being, in this business of providing clean products and with you having met and seen the customer side of the journey, do people even realize that diet and lifestyle play a role? And how can we emphasize that diet and lifestyle is certainly being a sustainable lifestyle. Yeah.  

Satyajit Hange: I [00:33:00] think it's time now that the modern medicine has been in in our daily lives, it's been more than 50, 60, 70 years. 

Satyajit Hange: All types of pills have become the norm of the day and we are realizing that it's not the pills that are giving us good health. There's, there is this growing, increasing awareness that one pill ultimately leads you to having another pill, which leads you to having another pill because of the side effects and because of them not being in your interest in the long term. 

Satyajit Hange: But when you consume good, clean food and your lifestyle is, corrected. you can live a healthy life without popping a single pill till you're 100. This sounds very novel in today's times, but this was normal in the village I come from, people lived 100 years without complicated health issues because their diet was clean and the lifestyle was good.[00:34:00]  

Vai Kumar: How do you think your ghee is like one of the special products and we all know ghee is from Ayurvedic lifestyle. We all know that ghee is meant to be medicinal, right? But people just buy any butter and then say, okay, I made homemade ghee. So what is the difference between melting the butter out of a store shelf versus the ghee that you provide or you create at Two Brothers? 

Satyajit Hange: Today ghee has come to mean clarified butter. Today ghee has come to mean a butter that you melt and it's ghee. But that is not Ghee. The first country where Ghee was made was India, and Airoda has written the benefits of Ghee in everything. But Ghee in India was never made the way it is made today. 

Satyajit Hange: It was always made by taking milk, then boiling it, then keeping it for a long time. It becomes lukewarm when inoculating it with fresh curds and then turning the entire milk to curds and then [00:35:00] turning the curds, and getting white butter and then melting that white butter to make ghee. It was a five step process. 

Satyajit Hange: And today there's a lot of awareness. Yeah, it's cultured ghee. You culture the milk to curds and turn the curds. So today, now there's awareness on the fact that this ghee actually melts below human body temperature. It has butyric acid, which is good for your gut microbiome, apart from having many other health benefits as enumerated in Ayurveda. 

Satyajit Hange: So the butter ghee is actually detrimental to your health. The cultured ghee is actually beneficial to  

Vai Kumar: Okay, perfect. And what about everything too, brothers, that you want to just talk about here, in terms of where people can find you, where they can shop, what they can do, because obviously there's going to be several of our listeners here that are completely new to your product and that can just benefit from such clean [00:36:00] product line. 

Vai Kumar: You're awesome. Happy to share. Yeah, your plea for all of us to kind of transition to a sustainable lifestyle and save Mother Earth.  

Satyajit Hange: Yeah, happy to share where you get the stuff that we make and happy to share with you guys. Just on Google, just type in True Brothers Organic Farms India. 

Satyajit Hange: The website will come and you can happily shop from there. We deliver from our village. to anywhere across the world in five days flat. So we've been doing this on the last five years. And the plea that I would like to make to everybody is, if not anything, no wise quotes from me, but if not anything, just be selfish, be selfish about your health be selfish about your children, because they have a future that's going to be on mother earth. 

Satyajit Hange: So be selfish and care for the earth, for your children are going to live in it. Okay. And be selfish and eat good clean food because it is the body [00:37:00] that is the only thing that accompanies you throughout your experiences in life till your death.  

Vai Kumar: I would like to add that be selfish about Turning the money that you make to buy clean products because, yeah, that's what matters at the day. 

Vai Kumar: Your health is your precious wealth. And, that's what matters the most. And so we all need to be selfish, not just about money, but mostly or mainly your health, right? So thank you so much for this fascinating conversation. I know, You and I are sitting miles apart to have this wonderful conversation and amidst all the challenges of technology and Wi Fi sitting in places where even technology has penetrated today is that's just fascinating. 

Vai Kumar: But thank you so much Satyajit for taking time to be with us today. And I really appreciate the conversation. My pleasure, Vai, and all the best to what you do. [00:38:00] Heartfelt wishes the world needs more people who protect sustainability and promote it. Thank you for inviting me.  

Vai Kumar: Sure, and I really look forward to the day when I would get to come see your farm in person and meet with you all and enjoy the work that you do. 

Vai Kumar: All do. Thank you so much once again. My pleasure. Thank you. Listen to us. As always, follow the podcast, rate the podcast, leave a review from your podcast type of choice. Follow me on Youtube and Instagram  @vaipkumar. That's V A I P K U M A R for all things digital media and lifestyle. Until next time with yet another interesting guest and yet another interesting topic. 

Vai Kumar: It's me, Vai, saying so long.